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View Full Version : Help with info on Miltitary Green 1939 Harley with gun holder



Donna18103
06-16-2018, 11:48 AM
Vin#SE2001PA
I HAVE REFERENCE # 3359511 York Harley
Any help would be great!

Rubone
06-16-2018, 12:33 PM
Your post doesn't have enough info to tell you a thing, other than that number you list as a VIN has nothing to do with a factory number. Without detailed pics of the bike there is nothing to go on.

T. Cotten
06-16-2018, 01:02 PM
Your post doesn't have enough info to tell you a thing, other than that number you list as a VIN has nothing to do with a factory number. Without detailed pics of the bike there is nothing to go on.
Welcome Donna18103!

Can you read a stamped number above the large hex plug in the left motor casing?

Some prefer to keep numbers private, but even with the last digit or two X'd out, we can guess a lot.
(Most more than me.)

Happy to help if we can,

...Cotten

Donna18103
06-16-2018, 05:51 PM
2227922278
Welcome Donna18103!

Can you read a stamped number above the large hex plug in the left motor casing?

Some prefer to keep numbers private, but even with the last digit or two X'd out, we can guess a lot.
(Most more than me.)

Happy to help if we can,

...Cotten

Those are the letters and numbers on the casing as you asked. Which is why I am perplexed. I also have a reference number???? York Harley#3359511..
This is on a piece of paper from the seller also there is motor... 4321488 frame a in a house like symbol 9 and also on this papaer are the letters ZE-85T
I have no clue about this scribble on the paper and he couldnít remember.
It has been sitting at this guys house for 15 years and then at his house for another 15!

Donna18103
06-16-2018, 05:54 PM
22280
I hope this helps

T. Cotten
06-16-2018, 06:28 PM
Yes, Donna18103!

At the top of your note are just common casting numbers and hallmarks upon many frames.

Most important is 43 21418
A Vehicle Identification Number would look more like 43EL2418, but we wanted to see '39?
So I suspect that is a 'production number' from the bellys of the casings. from '43 or later.

That would leave the possibility of no VIN in its usual place, hopefully because the cases were NOS replacements. That was quite common in the middle of the last Century. (Defaced numbers would make it a felony.)

It gets more complicated, but the more you can tell us, like if it is a 45" or a Big Twin, the more likely somebody more knowledgeable than I shall chime in...

.....Cotten

Donna18103
06-16-2018, 07:01 PM
Yes, Donna18103!

At the top of your note are just common casting numbers and hallmarks upon many frames.
Hello,
Thank You again. As I said I am an armature and donít know much about these things. But the engine is a 45. On the bottom of the crank case are the numbers21488 maybe more..I will look tomorrow for more. I guess the 21418 is wrong on his paper and the number 43 must be over more. Like I said I just picked it up and will look more tomorrow.
Thank You
Donna
Most important is 43 21418
A Vehicle Identification Number would look more like 43EL2418, but we wanted to see '39?
So I suspect that is a 'production number' from the bellys of the casings. from '43 or later.

That would leave the possibility of no VIN in its usual place, hopefully because the cases were NOS replacements. That was quite common in the middle of the last Century. (Defaced numbers would make it a felony.)

It gets more complicated, but the more you can tell us, like if it is a 45" or a Big Twin, the more likely somebody more knowledgeable than I shall chime in...

.....Cotten
Sorry I wrote above your note.

Rubone
06-16-2018, 08:09 PM
Well from your pics it is certainly not a '39.
The frame casting number you show with the A 9 corresponds with '43. That also matches the other number beginning with 43 which is stamped on the lower front of the engine casings and should be the same on both sides. I suspect the VIN number you show is a Pennsylvania assigned number stamped in place of the original H-D number. A picture of the case in that area would determine if it was done on the original or replacement cases.
There were no combat trim 45s in '39. In fact only a couple of prototypes were made and if painted other thna factory color would be military olive gloss, not flat. Gloss was used on all early military bikes and flat not until they were assembled for combat use, by either the US or its allies. Your picture shows a typical WLA, which despite being built in '43 would have originally had a number starting 42WLA XXXXX. All 42-45 WLAs were a series and all started with 42WLA..

Donna18103
06-16-2018, 08:51 PM
Well from your pics it is certainly not a '39.
The frame casting number you show with the A 9 corresponds with '43. That also matches the other number beginning with 43 which is stamped on the lower front of the engine casings and should be the same on both sides. I suspect the VIN number you show is a Pennsylvania assigned number stamped in place of the original H-D number. A picture of the case in that area would determine if it was done on the original or replacement cases.
There were no combat trim 45s in '39. In fact only a couple of prototypes were made and if painted other thna factory color would be military olive gloss, not flat. Gloss was used on all early military bikes and flat not until they were assembled for combat use, by either the US or its allies. Your picture shows a typical WLA, which despite being built in '43 would have originally had a number starting 42WLA XXXXX. All 42-45 WLAs were a series and all started with 42WLA..

Can you explain the title saying 1939? And I will take pics tomorrow of the casings and bottom of it to get the full number!
I Thank You SOO MUCH FOR ALL YOUR HELP !

Steve Slocombe
06-17-2018, 05:06 AM
Usually we can date these bikes from the headstock forging. ZE-35T is for a 45 cubic inch Harley, the A in the house is the logo from AmForge who made the part, and die number 9 is from 1943. This ties in with what is probably the engine belly numbers of 43-21418. So it could be a typical mid-year 1943 Harley 45 built for the military, with the engine numbers later restamped for a Pennsylvania title. This often happened when the authorities weren't sure about the build date, as shown by the 1939 date on the title. You don't need to do anything, although cleaning up the paperwork to show a 1943 build date might help in a subsequent sale.

Donna18103
06-17-2018, 05:48 PM
22285
Usually we can date these bikes from the headstock forging. ZE-35T is for a 45 cubic inch Harley, the A in the house is the logo from AmForge who made the part, and die number 9 is from 1943. This ties in with what is probably the engine belly numbers of 43-21418. So it could be a typical mid-year 1943 Harley 45 built for the military, with the engine numbers later restamped for a Pennsylvania title. This often happened when the authorities weren't sure about the build date, as shown by the 1939 date on the title. You don't need to do anything, although cleaning up the paperwork to show a 1943 build date might help in a subsequent sale.

22285
22286
22287
22288

Donna18103
06-17-2018, 05:50 PM
22285

22285
22286
22287
22288
The notary said that by the title it was sent overseas

Rubone
06-17-2018, 11:45 PM
The notary is on dope..
The number boss is ground down and restamped

Donna18103
06-18-2018, 04:53 AM
Wow.. she said there was a code or something on it that meant it was sent overseas.....

T. Cotten
06-18-2018, 09:35 AM
The notary is on dope..
The number boss is ground down and restampedDonna18103!

Although it is not really possible to tell if your number boss is "ground down" from your photo, the stamped VIN is definitely not from the Factory.

Even if it were a very common New Old Stock replacement case sent out blank many decades ago, perhaps stamped legally overseas, it complicates its legality in most of the US.

My state is quite repressive, however I would still request assistance from law enforcement and department of motor vehicles to straighten out the paperwork. Since they want perpetrators and not victims, they may add an inspection stamping, but avoid confiscation as a felony.
Unfortunately, the non-factory VIN still depreciates the hardware's value significantly.

Good luck!

...Cotten