View Full Version : Noisy 2nd gear 741 Scout
09-17-2009, 09:07 PM
Second gear in my 741 is really noisy, especially when I have the revs up ready to shift into 3rd. Why is second so noisy? Sounds like theres no lube in the tranny but the other 2 gears sound fine.
Second Gear on Chiefs and Scouts is the power or acceleration gear. Riders who like to twist the throttle in 2nd and then quickly back off for show don't realize the abuse they do to a 3spd non-syncro crashbox. When used and abused over the years and miles they get worn, tired and noisy. Sorry to see you bought a bike that appears to have bad numbers and tranny problems. It happens.
09-19-2009, 12:10 AM
My Sport Scouts numbers are a mess, so was my trans. 1st and 2nd gears are tooth to tooth on Indians. As been said they take a beating. Mine were bad enough I saved them, their on my shelf in my barn. Had several busted teeth, missing atleast a third of the tooth busted off. I never knew anything was wrong till I took it apart, worked fine and was not noisy. Have seen some repop gears, completly worn off - no teeth left on the 2nd gear. Looked like you had chucked it up in a lathe. Dont know what would cause the noise, but I am going to see folks tomorrow that might have a idea. Well get back to ya, hopefully with some useful info. Going to El Camino swap tomorrow.
Dont let the bad numbers get you down, the bikes still just as much fun ridding down the road. Get out and have fun with your Scout! I did on mine today :-) If the sounds to bad, get her fixed and get out there. My 25 Scout's in the shop right now, cant wait to get her back. Hope you enjoy your 741. Tom
09-19-2009, 07:28 PM
Might have to take a look at the tranny gears this winter. I appreciate any info on it, thanks. Ive been riding mine 10-20 miles every weekend and am having a blast on it. Im not too worried about the numbers, Ive used International Title Service several times and have even gone the bonded title route successfully. If worst comes to worst, I'll just bond it with the numbers it has on it and will be able to title and tag it. Its not getting sold in my lifetime anyway. :D
09-19-2009, 09:39 PM
Hi Scott, no big news - but just dissappointed your not getting more responces from those who know much more than me. I have been riding Scouts a while though and love em. The guys I talked too said, probably just a worn 2nd gear. Also said have one of your local Indian riders listen to it. It being your first Indian, maybe they might tell ya thats nothing, they all sound like that. I used to think my valves sounded like the hammers from hell when my SS was hot, now I hardly notice anymore.
All said if its quite in the other gears and the machine feels ok when going down the road, through the gears. They would ride it and not worry, if you start feeling somethings not right, then you might want to take a look in there. Some of those transmissions have taken alot of abuse. I was riding with a guy on a 101 once, for some reason he was really mad. His machine was not running right, well he was really abusing that thing, especially the trans. I think he was trying to brake it. Smashing it into gear with a terrible crash. But they are tough and really can take alot. Though you might be surprised as I was when you do look in there.
One thing I have learned from my 25 Scout, get in the right frame of mind as your getting ready to take off. It really helps make the ride much more enjoyable. They handle great and you cruise at a easy pace and enjoy the view. Pick your route carefully so your not fighting speeding traffic, if you can that is. If you can do that, then your Indian will be able to shine and you will get the most fun out of it. I do a 50 mile loop around our coast line and use alot of side streets to miss some of the traffic here in LA. Anyways sorry to ramble but I cant help it as I love Indian Scouts and want everyone to enjoy theirs as I have mine, good luck Tom.
09-20-2009, 08:44 AM
Thanks for the input
I have been following this thread as I just bought a 1942 741 that's been bobbed and between work and other things that I hope by mid week to have it running and this may be something that I to may be wondering or worring about. ;)
Tom, I always like hearing your reflections of the Injun Scout. These old bikes are truly meant to be ridden and enjoyed.
Scott...... I posted some info here.... http://www.antiquemotorcycle.org/bboard/showthread.php?p=85009#post85009 ........you may find some useful info...:D
09-21-2009, 09:15 PM
I'm no expert but in my experience most Chiefs moan in second. When they begin to howl and moan under deceleration as well as acceleration, it is most likely the countershaft and bushings are badly worn. The gears will be worn but if they are not very badly chewed up and/or missing teeth they are probably still serviceable.
If the countershaft and bushings are really far gone the gears can try to sorta climb each other and bust the transmission case between the right side bearing boss and the countershaft bushing boss. It pretty thin there. With that said, a busted case is not likely if you are not accelerating hard for all it will do then staying in gear and letting it unwind.
09-22-2009, 08:13 PM
Hey all, thanks for all your inputs and information. If I was to describe the noise, I would say it sounds like granny gear in the old 53 International straight truck I used to drive to haul grain. It was a 2-stick 15 speed and in low gear, it made the same wailing dry howl that my bike makes in second. I remember watching the old army shows like MASH and hearing the old jeeps with the same noise in the lower gears going through camp. Is second gear higher in the transmission where its not immersed in lube? Or is it a straight cut gear like 1st & 5th gear on my '07 Ultra Classic that makes a similar but lesser noise.
It doesnt sound like any damage is being done and I baby it so hopefully Im not doing it any harm. I live out in the country so I can pretty much pick my route without any traffic at all and enjoy the ride with no pressure. I seem to be in the right frame of mind when I ride the Scout and dont have much trouble remembering where the controls are. Maybe its because its real obvious that Im on an old machine and Im consciously thinking out every move. I do however seem to have a problem when I first jump on my modern HD and try to twist the left grip!
Thanks for the post on the riders manual c.o. I do have one of those along with a maintenance book and parts book. I got to use them already when it kept leaking gas out the overflow on the carb and I found the float rubbing on the side of the bowl. That was an easy fix but I fouled about 4 plugs afterwards until it finally cleared up. I love the simplicity of this bike and having as much fun working on it as I am riding it. Now you got ME rambling Tom! :p
Next time you have it out for a ride warm it up pretty good and drain the trans oil. See if there is any metal in the oil when it's done draining. If there is then over the winter tear the bike down and redo the trans. Wrestling the bike back together is a 2 man job as the motor/trans are part of the chassis. If you have never done one they can be a lot of fun. Jp
09-22-2009, 11:39 PM
Way to go guys, sounds good - I laughed and laughed. Glad I got you rambling Scott, and also I have a pretty good idea about you gear noise now. Since I have a 47 Chevy 2 ton COE and yep, those gears sing pretty good. Sounds like nice ridding out your way. I bet if your not pushing it too hard, it will run and run and run, many thousands of miles of fun. From what I have seen, if your ridding them for fun as an antique, not to work daily. They will amaze alot of folks and go for decades, with just regular up keep. I have done the same too, with my modern HD, going into a turn faster and faster, without meaning too. I dont know why they keep putting the throtle on the wrong side :-)
09-23-2009, 09:02 PM
I'll do that, thanks Jp. I installed an electric hoist from Harbor Freight above my bike lift. Best money I ever spent even if it is from China. Ive used it many times.
Took the bike for a ride today for about 30 miles, all gravel and dirt roads. It was a perfect Fall day here, about 65 degrees and nobody on the roads except a car about every 10 miles. I stopped at an intersection because my dang blackberry went off and I was fiddling with it (high technology you know) when a grizzly old timer on a sportster went past and then turned around and asked if I was having trouble. Nope, but I appreciate you stoppin. We both grinned and off we went in seperate directions. Nice to know I wont be stranded long if something happened, but I wasnt worried about that. I think the old girl likes the back roads. :o
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